Use this forum to ask questions about DataCAD 22 and DataCAD LT 22.
#80703 by ORWoody
Mon Mar 07, 2022 10:31 am
I just had a reason to feel grateful to various folks that wrote macros (tools) for my favorite program.
I am revising several extensive schedules as done on Acad for a new client and imported into DataCAD for modification and reuse. Whoever created them seemed to hack up "(typical)" like some people use "like". I simply went to my toolbox and opened Subtext, entered the last abbreviation before (Typ.), and then the abbreviation without (Typ.). Using the area selection, with two clicks, Subtext changed 162 string entries. Well, three actually since I had to click Yes when it needed to verify continue, but two sounds better.
A little rant here.... Something isn't typical if there are many cases where it isn't. The CAD program has nothing to do with overuse of typical, but this gave me a chance to hammer on Autocad.

As for the gratitude, I often have reason to mentally thank some person that I'll never know for some little tool that makes my life better and to Evan Shu for all his work that allowed me to learn about and to get those tools all in one place.
Thank you, Evan. RIP
#80789 by Joseph Baron
Wed Apr 06, 2022 1:23 am
A quick search on this reveals that J.B. CAD Services is the Subtext author.

I could not find our remember the person's name right now but they also authored Steelpro and having used that in my early Datacad days was one of the reasons that pushed me into learning DCAL.
#81153 by Kent A. Wittwer
Thu Jul 14, 2022 9:20 am
J.B. Cad Services. The guy who helped write those macros, Dave Burwell, out of Fort Wayne Indiana. The full story of those macros were as follows. The company that Dave and myself worked at was Schenkel Shultz Architects out of Fort Wayne. We had one of the first and largest CAD drafting departments in the states if I remember correctly. The Vice President of said company later on was a man by the name of Ron Torborg. He was the head of the CAD department. We used to use Computervision mainframe computers for the CAD work early on... enter the personal computer and enter AutoCRAP and DataCAD. You know who the winning platform was... So we developed standards and ways to increase the production. We had probably 20 users sitting behind DataCAD machines producing like madmen. Ron was the mastermind of the macros. He would sit behind a guy like me and watch me work and then we would come up with things like the break macro. I did plumbing, HVAC, structural, civil, etc. drawings and partial erase was three clicks instead of one with the break macro. We had hundreds of cool macros. Ron and Dave and a couple other people, Bob Peters was one, wrote and tailored these for the department. Pass by a few years and Dave quit and went to another firm... a lot of us quit and went to other firms... Dave then re-writes some of what he considered the more useful macros and ends up selling them to DataCAD. Quick Dave story, the firm he went to was dead set on them switching to AutoCAD so he does... but spends about a year writing lisp files and making AutoCAD work like DataCAD. I have to laugh because at one time I entertained going to work where he was but the AutoCAD requirement I couldn't get past. Still remember him saying, it works just like DataCAD. I'm like why not use DataCAD??? I digress. Dave had to rewrite the macros to work in the later versions of DataCAD. This was all stuff that was originally written for the DOS versions of DataCAD. Somewhere I still have a disc of a ton of the old macros that only work on the earliest versions of DataCAD. If I remember correctly, I was the guy who got Dave in touch with Mark to get J.B. Macros accessible. He wasn't using DataCAD anymore and didn't know what to do with them. Years later I talked with one of the other CAD users that was there longer than most and at that point was using AutoCAD ... I asked him if anyone kept any of that old DataCAD information. He said that they probably threw away all of those old macros and the paperwork that they were created from. I remember tons of binders of the layouts and all of the code printed out... sad. By the way, Schenkel Shultz in Fort Wayne does not exist anymore. We had an amazing time in that Department. It was a band of brothers for sure. I have not talked to Dave or Ron in many many years. I still speak with Bob a bit. I think there are only two or three of us that still use DataCAD. I still use all of those macros.

Ok back to work.
#81154 by ORWoody
Thu Jul 14, 2022 10:23 am
Thank you, Kent. I might not be able to tell each of you individually how much you helped me have a happy and successful career, but it's still a fact. I learned basic Autocad first in 1986. After a year of working with it full time to do minor plans and details, I found it to be nothing more than a very inefficient way to get lines on paper. It certainly wasn't faster than manual drafting. I joked (halfway seriously) about the fastest ACAD drafter still being slower than the slowest manual drafter that I'd ever worked with. Although ACAD was already dominating the recognition part of the market, it was the big guy.

On a whim, I went to a demonstration by a sales team that showed ACAD, Versacad, and DataCAD. The ACAD demo guy didn't actually draw anything at first. He simply showed a wireframe model of a jet airliner and rotated it around while discussing all of the advantages of ACAD. As his portion of the demo hit the end, some other architect asked him to draw a simple plan with a few walls, windows, doors, etc. No 3D, just 2D level drafting. It was a disaster. The amount of typing, off-setting, trimming, and general clean-up had every architect there, and there were several, almost ready to leave before the demo was complete. Remember. This was back before keyboarding was practically from birth skill like it is now.

I remember absolutely nothing about the Versacad demo, other than my noting that the blue Autocad menu with its white lettering looked better than did the Versacad menu.

The DataCAD demo was given by the same person that had done the Autocad demo so I really didn't expect much. He'd been so enthusiastic about Autocad, that I knew that he had a built-in bias. When the DCAD screen came up, I was back to thinking that the ACAD menu looked better. Then, the demonstrator showed how the "relative" tracking worked and compared it to ACAD's absolute tracking. It was as if a light clicked on that someone in the programming field for DataCAD was truly thinking about how a person usually works relative to the last point picked, not the absolute 0,0 point. Someone even asked if ACAD could do that and the negative answer wasn't welcomed at all.

Parallel lines, clean-up tools, door and windows, etc., had every architect there enthusiastically asking questions and getting every single one answered by the demonstrator. He made the comment that he'd never understood why every other CAD program required a menu or key selection to draw a line. Why else were we sitting at the computer? As far as he knew, DataCAD was the only program that defaulted to the line command and allowed for quick keys (without the subsequent enter) and those alone saved hundreds if not thousands of keystrokes for any sizeable set of drawings.

I was instantly sold. I remained after the demo to ask more about DataCAD. The demonstrator showed me a couple of things with the big ones being the macros. I'd mentioned that I was writing very, very basic Lisp routines, so he explained that the macros were similar in that they existed outside the basic program, but were instantly accessible and were for the most part, transparent. I never expected to be very proficient at writing macros, and I definitely lived up to all of my expectations. Fortunately, there were a lot of people out there that weren't as limited as I and have written some mind-boggling tools.

As for the demonstration and demonstrator; I returned a week later to purchase a copy of DataCAD and the demonstrator no longer was able to sell it. His main office had dropped the program because after a year of holding one multiple product demonstrations per month, had not sold a single copy. The architects would all rave about DataCAD at the demonstration and go back to their offices planning to return and purchase it. At the office, engineers, other architects, and second semester summer hires would all tout the wonders of Autocad without having a clue as to the advantages of DataCAD. The architect and his checkbook would then return to purchase ACAD by the wheelbarrow load. The demonstrator was mystified at how that worked.

As for me... I had to go to Dallas to get a copy, when I got there, that sales person was no longer in business. I actually called Charlottesville from the Dallas airport to buy direct which was how I ended up attempting unsuccessfully to be a distributor myself. I ended up exactly like the previous distributor in Houston with no sales after a year, but with a burning hatred for ACAD. An envious, burning hatred.

I'm still grateful for all of you that worked so hard bringing DataCAD and all of those useful wonderful tools to fruition. My life has been made better every day because of you.
#81156 by Kent A. Wittwer
Thu Jul 14, 2022 11:39 am
I will have to say that my training back in the day and our ability to fine tune how we worked with reducing clicks and keystrokes has stuck with me to this day. I am very grateful for the DataCAD team because I have done well with my career because of their tool. I feel the pain of constantly being forced into AutCRAP or Revit or whatever. I was hired at a restaurant company (Pizza Hut of Fort Wayne) and started their own CAD Department. The owner had more money than most so he had a huge operation which included a woodworking shop down to breeding horses. I tried at that point to do the switch. I contacted the ACAD salesman and purchased the software and then spent 6 months getting absolutely nothing done. Every time I wanted to do anything like put in a door I had to buy more software or become a programmer to make that happen. Six months later I abandoned ship and was back using DataCAD getting work done. I had fricking pizza makers and accountants telling me what software I should be using... what a damn joke. I look back on that experience with a whole different opinion now. The current company that I do work for (I am self employed and have been for almost 20 years) has had me doing spectacular (their words) work for them for the last 18 years all with DataCAD... and some Sketchup since it works well with DataCAD created models. They are pushing hard for Revit and I am kicking and screaming. I look at Revit produced drawings and cant help but laugh. A whole lot of lines and no pertinent information. Hell I am presently looking at a "Dimensioned Floor Plan" for a National Institute of Health project and on one plan I see about 20 actual dimensions??? What am I missing??? These plans literally suck. Maybe they can produce those useless plans faster but with no information on there, who cares? I keep saying I am glad I am getting older because at some point I will walk away and never look back if I am forced into AutoCRAP land.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

About DataCAD Forum

The DataCAD Forum is a FREE online community we provide to enhance your experience with DataCAD.

We hope you'll visit often to get answers, share ideas, and interact with other DataCAD users around the world.

DataCAD

Software for Architects Since 1984