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#76453 by mfmanuel
Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:12 am
I realize I am not using DataCAD to its full potential so bear with me. I usually produce construction documents on 24x36 borders most plans are at 1/4"=1'-0" scale. If I have larger scale drawings or details I just reduce my border accordingly. I have a GC who wants to print sets reduced to 11x17 sheets and still be to 1/8" scale in addition to the full size. I know I am missing something big with the borders thing can someone point me in the right direction?
Thanks,
Matt
#76476 by Mark Bell
Sat Jun 08, 2019 7:18 pm
Hi Matt,
You can save the drawings to a PDF, then the end user can print them out at whatever paper size their printer supports. Alternatively, if you set the drawings up in MSP, (at 1:1 actual size), the Setup for printing allows you to output from actual size to another size, even if you don't have that specific printer/plotter, ie. place your original A1 (whatever the US equivalent is), then output to A3 or A4 size using Check Print - this can be to PDF or directly to a printer.
If the contractor wants to print the full size set at a reduced paper size (most likely to save printing costs), either they will have to accept the reducing scaling including text size etc. or you will have to redo every sheet using the smaller sheet size, which will probably increase the number of drawings in the total set.
#76484 by mfmanuel
Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:38 pm
Mark Bell wrote:Hi Matt,
You can save the drawings to a PDF, then the end user can print them out at whatever paper size their printer supports. Alternatively, if you set the drawings up in MSP, (at 1:1 actual size), the Setup for printing allows you to output from actual size to another size, even if you don't have that specific printer/plotter, ie. place your original A1 (whatever the US equivalent is), then output to A3 or A4 size using Check Print - this can be to PDF or directly to a printer.
If the contractor wants to print the full size set at a reduced paper size (most likely to save printing costs), either they will have to accept the reducing scaling including text size etc. or you will have to redo every sheet using the smaller sheet size, which will probably increase the number of drawings in the total set.


Thank you for responding Mark! This is what I was looking for. I have never tried to use MSP before, I will try to find a tutorial on that. I already save plot files to .PDF files, but as you know the file will only print to scale as the file was was saved. Any "shrink to fit" paper sizes will throw off the scale. If I can create a reduced scale .PDF (like 1/8"=1'-0") from the same drawing using MSP that would be very helpful. Any pointers to get started on this would be appreciated. Thanks again!
Matt
#76488 by Mark Bell
Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:15 pm
Hi Matt,

Have a look in the Help/Reference Manual and search multi-scale plotting. Cheap Tricks also did a number of articles years ago. I've included one off Google below. MSP is pretty easy and straight forward to use and you don't have to use all the commands to get benefit from it as some offer more advanced features you may not need straight away. The main point to remember with MSP, is everything you place on the sheet is at real scale, including the title sheet - all you do is scroll up/down to change to printing scale prior to placing the detail on the sheet. Once all your details and corresponding print scales are done, then you know what text size for each detail to use so the printed output has text at a consistent size.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... A7Ivlolz6S
#77365 by Ted B
Sat Dec 07, 2019 2:15 am
I've been producing all my construction documents at 11x17" for nearly 20-years now. On the rare instance I need or am required to submit 24x36" I just increae the .pdf by 200%. At 22x34"-actual no-one notices the extra-wide paper borders. Where I'm located the nearest high-volume blueprint houses are either over an hour away in the next state, or 90-mins drive North into the NYC suburbs. ...Or there's Staples **grrr** and thats a 30-mile round trip.

Years ago I started using reduced sets for CAD drawing bid-sets and field-sets in corporate-land...and saved $750,000 a year in repro. ...which my boss took credit-for with the Higher-Ups. **grrrr** You just need to leave a slightly-generous paper border if your originals are 24x36" and watch that the text-size isn't too-small at 50%. Mainly I find you need more sheets for details at 11x17 to maintain clarity and completeness, but the repro is cheap!
#77412 by artmanvt2000
Mon Dec 30, 2019 3:12 pm
Your network printer allows us to print to 12"x18" paper for "full bleed" publishing printing. It is very useful for printing half size sets of our 24"x36" drawings. We started putting bar scales on our drawings to alert end user of the drawings that the drawing are not to the scale noted on the drawing. We don't change the scale notation for half size sets.

The check plot feature in the print menu works great for printing half size sets too, with the need to create pdf files every time we print.
#78762 by ORWoody
Sat Sep 12, 2020 8:46 pm
I realize that this thread is more than a year and a half old, but I hope that my response works for some newer users.
Use your main file or files in the usual way. Fortunately, for me, my projects can generally correspond to the one project, one file rule. That file has a selected border size that is set at a 1:1 scale in the print settings.
My default drawings have almost all of the layers preset and in order so that for single story or two story residential or commercial, I just open the new file and go. Once in awhile, I'll have some uncommon condition that necessitates extra layers or new layers, but that isn't a big problem.
If i assume that I will be printing a two story residence on 24x36 sheets, I use my 24x36-2R default drawing.
My first layer in the file list is named 24x36. It has the border lines, project title, misc. disclaimers, etc., all of the things that will be common to every drawing sheet in the final set.
After the border comes layers for plans, elevations, sections, details, schedules, and so on.
Following the actual "drawings" are layers for the sheet numbers and sheet names. Cover Text, C1, C2, C3. S1, S2, S3, A1... A20, M1... M4, E1... E5, P1... P4. Those entities are all overlaid as needed for their correct position on the border.
The next group of layers is what makes everything work for me. Their names are C1XRefs... C3XRefs, S1XRefs... S3XRefs, A1XRefs... A20XRefs, M1XRefs... M4XRefs, E1XRefs... E5XRefs, P1XREFS... P4XRefs. All of the sheets are created as GoToViews with the sheet numbers as the GoToView name. Each print sheet will have only three layers that are on, the border, the sheet number/name text and the corresponding (sheet number) XRefs.
By doing this, I can modify drawings more easily than I could when I used multi-layout for plotting. I really liked multi-layout, but this just seemed slightly better for me.
Which now brings us to the original question of document sets with different size borders.
I would simply create a secondary file for the odd size sheets set using my 11x17 default drawing. I'd build the sheets by inserting the XRefs of the original drawing file as needed and at whatever scale worked best. Most would be almost always be at half the scale used for the 24x36 set. That's why I have gone to graphic scales for almost all of my work. I also have slightly different pen settings for smaller scale drawing sets to keep text readable. This system also makes a single print layout work for all of the drawings in the set.
Good luck,
Woody

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